Championship Contenders: Robert Kubica
BMW have been on the radar all season, but only as a support act, there to pick up the pieces when it all goes wrong at the front. Kubica collected his and the team’s first win at Canada this year, and even though it was an important moment, it didn’t mark a defining improvement for them. In fact, BMWs fortunes dropped slightly after that impressive 1-2.
Nevertheless, and much to Bernie’s dismay, consistency keeps you near the top, and with only two races left, Kubica is still in contention for the driver’s title. If you had to choose between Kubica or Raikkonen making it to the final battle, wouldn’t you have picked the defending champion?
There’s an argument to say that Kubica doesn’t necessarily deserve this year’s title. He certainly hasn’t scrapped as hard as the top two, but who’s to say that’s a bad thing? Whenever there is any faltering at the top, Kubica is there to maximise on the opportunity. Keeping your nose clean is more than half the battle, especially this season. Not only that, but compared to some of the performances Heidfeld has put in this year, it’s clear Kub is getting more out of his car.
Perhaps the secret to his championship potential is the silent but deadly variety. To me, he has never really stood out with an outstanding performance, but at the same time, when has he ever done anything wrong? Aside from a slight slip up at Silverstone, I honestly can’t recall another single mistake by the man, and the most controversy he has inspired this year is whether those “Pole on pole” headlines should ever have been allowed.
The one thing Kubica has against him is the team are resigned to being third. They know that McLaren and Ferrari have the extra pace to keep them at the top, and their only goal was the solitary win this year. Having achieved that, they were already looking to 2009, whilst Kubica stood at the back of the garage shouting: “Hey, guys, you know, we could still win this!” Of course the odds were against them, but to be the only guy believing you still have a fighting chance must be quite draining in a team as clinical as BMW. When their objectives are aligned, the team are a force to be reckoned with, but when the bosses turn on you, as Heidfeld learnt earlier in the season, you’ve got to stand your ground and prove your worth. BMW finally figured out this week that Robert had been right all along, and he now has the full backing of Theissen and his boys for the remainder of the season. The big question is, have they left it too late?
Picking up 12 points in the last two races is entirely possible for the Pole, but the added problem comes from requiring the other contenders to fail. In fact, to remain in contention post-China, he really needs to finish at least two places ahead of Lewis. Of course, we saw last year that you can never say never in this business.
October 15th, 2008 at 1:13 pmme said:
they must be kicking themselves mustn’t they?
if they kept pushing as hard after canada as renault have, the kub would’ve had it wrapped up by now.
amazingly, that canadian win could well have been the worst thing to happen to them.
October 15th, 2008 at 1:23 pmJourneyer said:
But then, if he were pushing harder, Hamilton and Massa would’ve probably been more behaved, so they’d still end up ahead on balance.
Given the nature of Hamilton and Massa, it’s very much possible for Robert to gain 13 points and win the title. Let’s remember Raikkonen gained 18 points last year.
October 15th, 2008 at 1:28 pmAlex Andronov said:
And for Kubica…
I nose I shouldn’t go there.
It’s really snot fair to criticise him.
I tried to resist but I conked out.
S(n)oz
October 15th, 2008 at 2:02 pmLalPedal said:
“There’s an argument to say that Kubica doesn’t necessarily deserve this year’s title. He certainly hasn’t scrapped as hard as the top two”
“he has never really stood out with an outstanding performance”
Have I been watching a different F1 season to you?
Kubica is by far the most impressive driver in F1 today and the most deserving of the championship. He has been practically flawless all year.
October 15th, 2008 at 2:05 pmKeith Collantine said:
Actually I’d say his performance at Fuji was just that. Look at what Heidfeld was doing with the same car - not getting past Q1 and finishing out of the points despite the championship leaders screwing their races up and the other McLaren retiring.
Kubica did an incredible job keeping Raikkonen behind him. Look at these maximum speed figures from the start/finish line during the race:
Kubica 304.6kph
Heidfeld 306.7kph
Massa 311.6kph
Raikkonen 312.5kph
Massa went past Heidfeld like the BMW was going backwards - yet Kubica kept Raikkonen behind for all of the final stint, and his defence was scrupulously fair.
But I agree with your main point totally - he’s been quick, consistent and he’s made few mistakes. The main reasons he’s not in a stronger position in the title race are arguably not his doing: BMW failing to developing their car quickly enough, Nakajima hitting him at Melbourne and the safety car at Singapore.
October 15th, 2008 at 2:10 pmChristine said:
Absolutely, and the end of the sentence: “he has never really stood out with an outstanding performance” actually finishes with your very sentiment.
It’s a personal opinion, and I think that he hasn’t made me stand up and take notice. That doesn’t mean he’s not the best driver out there, in fact, it probably means he is. He makes it look easy, whilst the others have just embarrassed themselves.
October 15th, 2008 at 2:30 pmAlex Andronov said:
Kubica and Vettel have impressed me this year for I think the same reason.
I think both of them are outdriving their car by a significant margin.
October 15th, 2008 at 2:36 pmme said:
that’s quite a statement lalpedal. for me the most impressive driver today would be vettel.
he had a rough start to the season, but the car he’s driving aint no ferrari, mclaren or bmw, yet he still secured his first win.
i would agree that of the three contenders though, kubica’s the most deserving of the title.
October 15th, 2008 at 2:39 pmme said:
to be honest, if massa came anywhere near me, i’d stop the car and wave him by.
kubica only actually had to put up a lap and bits worth of defence though didn’t he? just enough to mitigate kimi’s advantage.
when massa met heidfeld, he wasn’t suffering tyre issues so stayed close and sailed on by.
October 15th, 2008 at 2:41 pmme said:
who would you say has impressed you most of the two and why?
October 15th, 2008 at 3:04 pmAlex Andronov said:
Vettel absolutely. The car is worse and his win was actually less fortuitous. More like Alonso’s second win than his first.
October 15th, 2008 at 3:05 pmAlex Andronov said:
This season I mean. Fuji rather than Singapore.
October 15th, 2008 at 3:07 pmme said:
am with ya and i agree.
October 15th, 2008 at 3:12 pmAlex Andronov said:
I’ve just totally agreed with you on the other thread too Me.
Quick we need something controversial
October 15th, 2008 at 3:23 pmSteven Roy said:
I have never believed that the driver with the most wins should necessarily be champion but the idea of Kubica ending the year as champion would be laughable. How could anyone ever take the championship seriously again when someone who has only made the podium 7 times won it. Albeit he would have to make the podium in the last two races. It is very easy to be consistent and look good when you are under no pressure. Why did Lewis make the mistake in Japan? Because he was battling for the lead not 6th or 7th. Over the years we have see lots of drivers make inferior equipment look good and while they are doing that everyone tells them how wonderful they are. We will not find out how good Kubica and Vettel are until they are in race winning cars and under pressure to deliver every time they go out on track and when ever minor mistake or wrong decision they make gets slaughtered by all and sundry and they have to spend a lot of their time explaining to the press why they missed a braking point.
It is unfair to slag off Heidfeld for his qualifying position in Japan. His team mate who apparently now is considered to be the driver of the season was 0.15 seconds and two places above him in Q1 and scraped into Q2 by the skin of his teeth.
Kubica may still be in with a chance of the title but that is only because of some unusual stewards decisions. In reality Lewis Hamilton should only need a couple of points to seal it with Kubica out of it. Had the stewards decided Massa deliberately drove into him in Japan and given a commensurate penalty the title would be wrapped up now.
Kubica has driven well this season but Heidfeld is only 16 points behind him in a car which we have been told for most of the season does not suit him.
October 15th, 2008 at 3:24 pmme said:
what’s your opinion on mushrooms?
October 15th, 2008 at 3:27 pmme said:
out of interest then, your driver of the season (thus far)?
October 15th, 2008 at 3:28 pmAlex Andronov said:
Absolutely!
We have been absolutely spoilt by Michael Schumacher. Like him or loath him he was incredibly good under pressure (mainly by being able to avoid being put under it in the first place).
Kimi avoided the pressure last year and won in some fair part because of it. Lewis under pressure last year and this has yet to get over it but only Alonso and Schumacher know what the modern pressure is like. And Schumacher managed to cope with is so well that the Alonso outbursts, the Massa name calling and the Lewis tempestuousness all seem somewhat childish in comparison.
But actually very few men have been through this and Schumacher was something else in this regard.
October 15th, 2008 at 3:29 pmAlex Andronov said:
I like mushrooms
October 15th, 2008 at 3:31 pmme said:
yippee, i dislike mushrooms
October 15th, 2008 at 3:33 pmme said:
a damn good point. i’m therefore assuming steven finds kimi’s world championship laughable?
October 15th, 2008 at 3:33 pmAlex Andronov said:
Well that’s it then! FIGHT! (okay maybe not)
October 15th, 2008 at 3:46 pmme said:
if i’m honest, i’m struggling to get riled up about your appreciation for the mushroom. damn it.
October 15th, 2008 at 3:49 pmAlex Andronov said:
I agree with you
October 15th, 2008 at 4:21 pmSteven Roy said:
I don’t like being treated like a mushroom by the FIA and the stewards
October 15th, 2008 at 4:37 pmJordan Allen said:
Actually it would add more lusture to the Driver’s championship for Kubica to win with with 7 podium finishes (really 9 finishes) becasue the Driver’s championship by your logic has been a farce since 1982, when Rosberg won it with just six trips to the podium…
Careful, Steven if people did not know you are a Gillies fan they might have believed that last paragraph. Admit it, this is not about the number of podiums you get as a driver and more resentment that Kosberg only got the ‘82 title becasue Villeneuve died….
Yes, well, we can not expect Barrichello to be either 17th or 16th places all the time like we can except button to be behind both Force Indias now can we? after 18th place it is really quite a lottery to figure out who should end up where until you come to the top four…
Kubica may still be in with a chance of the title but that is only because of some unusual stewards decisions. In reality Lewis Hamilton should only need a couple of points to seal it with Kubica out of it. Had the stewards decided Massa deliberately drove into him in Japan and given a commensurate penalty the title would be wrapped up now.
Kubica has driven well this season but Heidfeld is only 16 points behind him in a car which we have been told for most of the season does not suit him.
October 15th, 2008 at 4:42 pmSteven Roy said:
Kimi won 6 races and was only off the podium 2 or 3 times which is a bit different to Kubica this season.
October 15th, 2008 at 4:45 pmJordan Allen said:
Mushrooms are feed manure and they are always in the dark.
October 15th, 2008 at 4:47 pmSteven Roy said:
There were 11 different race winners that year and the real champion Villeneuve was killed and the second choice Pironi trashed his legs at Hockenheim. So a very odd season all round.
October 15th, 2008 at 4:47 pmSteven Roy said:
October 15th, 2008 at 4:54 pmAlex Andronov said:
So overall I think I am in favour of Lewis winning the championship this season.
Why?
Because Lewis is doing much better than the man with equal experience in his sister car. He is doing about as well if not better than the guys in the Ferraris which are pretty similar cars and he has a lot less experience.
He is continuing to show them up as not as great as they thought they were.
I remember that before Lewis started last year people were saying Ron was mad to put Lewis in the car. There was no way he’d be able to cope up at the front end. That he would likely be behind then predicted third team Renault most of the time. And that this crazy scheme was only being considered because they had Alonso and nobody had Schumacher.
In fact what they were predicting is largely what is happening to Hekki this year (in his second year).
Lewis is a better driver than Massa (and I like Massa).
Also Ferrari have really been shown up this year in the pit stops which, in my opinion should count against them being “worthy” winners of the constructors if that’s what we’re saying.
So for all of those reasons I would like to see a Lewis / McLaren win this season.
Those reasons and that it would be the result that will make Max the most cross.
October 15th, 2008 at 4:57 pmAlex Andronov said:
Steven I’d just like to throw you a conspiracy theory around your smooth drivers being disadvantaged this year theory.
What’s really changed in the regulations this year? Not much…
Unless it’s the McLaren ECU!
And who has the most choppy tail happy style on the grid?
Why could it be Lewis?
I have no idea if this stacks up / makes technical sense. But I thought I should share
October 15th, 2008 at 5:22 pmR.G (My fuji, 12th October 2008, they day LIVE went wrong) said:
Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear, you have got a lot of things wrong my friend.
Have you been watching this season? The car is absolutly no where near as good as the McLarens or Ferraris, yet Kova and Kimi have been ruled out of winning, he is only 12 points behind, for god’s sake, he’s been outperforming this car, look at Nicky, he’s been the Alonso for this team.
Canada, Monaco, Bahrain, Malaysia, Japan, you want me to go on?
So doesn’t that make us strong faves for 2009, since we started well before the top 2?
This is a post I made on another forum about the same thing:
In Aus he was unlucky due to Nakajima incompetence. In GB he was unlucky due to the appauling conditions, where 1 driver made no mistake.
Aside from that, he got our first pole, and was desperatly unlucky not to get ones in aus and canada, he got our first win, he’s still in the title hunt, which is better than Raikkonen and Kovalainen, two drivers in supposedly better cars, has yet to have a mechanical failure all year, as with Heidfeld.
Honestly, if Heidfeld didn’t have them qualy issues, BMW could easily be top of the constructors too. And I hope he wins it as Massa and Hamilton have been too inconsistent.
October 15th, 2008 at 5:41 pmme said:
nope, but i wouldn’t mind if you picked out what he did in those races that was outstanding?
at the moment, you’ve simply named some races the guy competed in
October 15th, 2008 at 5:51 pmAlex Andronov said:
Honestly if McLaren hadn’t had those FIA issues…
Honestly if Kimi hadn’t had those Quali issues…
October 15th, 2008 at 5:56 pmme said:
honestly if piquet… oh wait.
October 15th, 2008 at 5:58 pmSteven Roy said:
Works for me Alex. The thing that really bugs me about what has happened is that I spent most of last year telling anyone who would listen that this season’s regs would favour the smoother drivers. No T/C and more importantly no braking stability thingumyjig
October 15th, 2008 at 6:01 pmSteven Roy said:
Honestly if the Renault wasn’t rubbish Alonso would have had the title sewn up by Spa
If Honda’s car was 5 seconds a lap faster Rubens would be champion
October 15th, 2008 at 6:02 pmR.G (My fuji, 12th October 2008, they day LIVE went wrong) said:
Canada - Won the whole race. unlucky not to get pole
Bahrain - Got the team’s first ever pole posistion even when Massa was looking favourite to get pole
Monaco - Kept himself with it in the rain
Malaysia - Solid to finish in his highest ever finish then…
Japan - Along with Alonso, he was quick, and was most likely the best/second best driver of the day.
and more
Aus - Unbelievably unlucky not to get pole, BMW strategy ruined him.
Why should a driver without a good performance be 12 points away from the leader? The only dissapointing performance by him has probably be either Germany or Hungary, when the car was poor.
October 15th, 2008 at 6:52 pmme said:
ollie just pointed this out on identi.ca:
French Grand Prix cancelled!
more: http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns20880.html
October 15th, 2008 at 6:57 pmme said:
having said that, no sooner do i finish typing and christine produces:
http://www.f1minute.com/2008/10/15/15-oct-08-french-grand-prix-cancelled-for-2009/
October 15th, 2008 at 7:03 pmR.G (My fuji, 12th October 2008, they day LIVE went wrong) said:
Wait, that can surely mean a possible come back for Canada then?
October 15th, 2008 at 7:09 pmme said:
fair enough. i’d argue that i didn’t see anything outstanding in monaco and i can’t for the life of me remember what he did in malaysia? the rest i agree with you though.
it means they’re in a better position than they were this morning
October 15th, 2008 at 7:42 pmDank said:
I’ve put £10 on Kubica to win at 20/1. I would love it if ol’ Kubes won and the £200 would be rather nice as well
October 15th, 2008 at 7:59 pmRich said:
I think Robert is the most impressive driver this year by a huge margin. Sure Vettel has done well - but the combination of a Newby design and Ferrari power that car is going to be good. BMW Sauber since Canada has been somewhat off the pace in terms of speed (compared to Red Bull, Toyota, STR and Renault) but generally their tactics and good driving by BOTH drivers has done the team proud. Heidfeld has had more bad luck this year (e.g. Alonso driving into him at Monaco) and qualifying problems. Both drivers make Lewis and Kovy look like clowns. Poor Macca best car but idiot drivers if they had Robert and Nick their championship would be sewn up!
This is just laughable … Felipe made a mistake went too deep, Lewis was aggressive in not giving any space (not necessarily wrong - same as Kimi with Lewis at Belgium) so Felip was off the road. Did it deserve a penalty? Probably and in my book no where near as crazy as Lewis and Kovy at the start. Both McLarens look as if they were deliberately trying to take out the Ferraris. I really hope (and pray) both McLarens fall off the track permanently from both races (without consequence to any one else) so the rest of the drivers can compete fairly.
October 15th, 2008 at 8:10 pmRich said:
I admire Robert but Kimi and Fernando were more impressive on that day. When Massa was not trophy hunting other cars he was seriously quick at Japan ( I was looking at his times a lot!) and he went past Webber and Heidfeld like they were Force India drivers.
No question Kimi would have won had both Maccas bashed him at the start. I think Kimi is so livid with Lewis that he might well take him out in the next two races (I know I would …. seriously I would since Lewis has wrecked two races for Kimi and defence of his championship. Even Nick Heidfeld was highly critical of Lewis’ start at Japan.
October 15th, 2008 at 8:33 pmme said:
TED news!
“Homologation rules say you are only allowed to change the design of engine parts if they are cheaper to manufacture, or are more reliable than the old ones.”
“Renault cottoned on rather late that this was going on, and other teams confirm that Renault have made some changes for reliability since mid-season, which have been approved, in line with the FIA regulations.”
unless i’ve missed something, is this the first official confirmation that renault have in fact made changes to their power unit? i mean aside from the car being faster and the team winning races.
more here: http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?Type=Ted_Kravitz&id=44273
October 15th, 2008 at 8:35 pmScott Woodwiss (Gotta beat Christine in FR) said:
Can I just say one thing on the French GP cancellation:
HALLE-BLOODY-LUJAH!
October 15th, 2008 at 8:36 pmme said:
i could see that happening too. what’s he got to lose?
it’s gonna be like bumper cars out there on sunday.
October 15th, 2008 at 8:38 pmFlibster said:
Oh joy!
At last!
October 15th, 2008 at 8:45 pmFlibs said:
Any reason why all my comments are being marked as spam?
October 15th, 2008 at 8:51 pmme said:
no idea flibs? that one came through okay.
i has fished em out for ya.
October 15th, 2008 at 8:53 pmFlibster said:
Lets try again then…
October 15th, 2008 at 8:53 pmFlibster said:
WOOHOO!
October 15th, 2008 at 9:09 pmRich said:
Kimi has absolutely nothing to lose as also fines seem to make no difference to him. Even Fernando might be tempted (it could be argued that Lewis’s practice antics at Hungary last year cost him a chance at the WDC). Finally I can even see Timo paying back a favour from Monza (he is feisty and very upset with Lewis).
I think Lewis is odds on favourite and Felipe at Japan was showing signs of strain as the pit crew were in the [previous race.
I think it could be bumper cars even without an impetuous Lewis.
October 15th, 2008 at 9:14 pmme said:
so is trulli (for blocking under blue flags). but can either toyota get close enough to cause problems?
October 15th, 2008 at 9:33 pmSteven Roy said:
Kimi has way too much class to take anyone out and I think depite his comments so does Alonso.
October 15th, 2008 at 9:44 pmme said:
i dunno. just watched the FOM video round-up for fuji and watch alonso before corner 3.
he sweeps right across lewis’ path and bangs wheels.
looks intentional to me. one deft move from the right of the track, to the left and then back again.
http://www.f1.com/services/play_video.html
October 15th, 2008 at 9:46 pmRich said:
You have two EX World Champions who are rather bitter and have both publicly indicated support for Felipe. In truth I would rather Lewis and Kovy took themselves out rather than mar the sport with Schumacher and Senna antics by other drivers.
Trulli is not quite as mad about Lewis as Timo - both Toyota drivers are capable of getting into Q3 - with a light fuel at the start they could be in position. I doubt that Jarno would though. Even mild Nick is sounding off on Lewis!
October 15th, 2008 at 9:50 pmRich said:
source: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71398
Has anyone seen this? I think shorter races will detract from F1 - with talk of same engines and minimum aero development during the year it seems as if F1 is becoming like A1 GP!
October 15th, 2008 at 9:57 pmRich said:
Unfreezing the engine freeze
Ron as the following pertinent comment…
October 15th, 2008 at 10:02 pmme said:
a valid argument. however, the teams brought this on themselves. some of the field performed upgrades and others didn’t.
if everybody had done the same there would be no differential to discuss.
thing is, nobody thought for a second the freeze would ever work. not for 10 years, not for 5 years. frankly, i’m amazed it lasted the whole season.
October 15th, 2008 at 10:14 pmRich said:
Do we know this for sure!
I think to freeze development for the season is fine - the problem is why and does it save money.
While I am in favour of KERS for environmental reasons and as a technological development it is in line with F1’s glamour it adds hugely to the cost.
October 15th, 2008 at 10:18 pmme said:
mm, well as sure as we can be. see ted news earlier in this thread.
given teams keep upgrading stuff, probably not.
October 15th, 2008 at 10:21 pmSteven Roy said:
I don’t have a problem with that. In modern racing what Alonso did was pretty normal. The thing I found interesting was the view they showed of the first corner incident. Lewis clearly touches Kimi but shoots off the track. It is really Heikki that took Kimi off the track and affected his progress.
October 15th, 2008 at 10:25 pmSteven Roy said:
We know some of them have made upgrades. I haven’t seen anything elsewhere to say any manufacturer has made no updates at all although Flavio’s comments suggest that Renault have made no upgrades but I don’t trust anything he says or does.
The trouble with that is that if a team has a technical problem at the start of the season they are stuck with the problem for the season.
October 15th, 2008 at 10:26 pmme said:
so, why were the macca’s poor under braking, going into the first corner then? was it an extra slow warm-up lap? lewis should’ve been able to control the pace. was everyone else super-slow at lining up or something?
October 15th, 2008 at 10:29 pmAlex Andronov said:
On the engine unfreeze it does seem that the people with the powerful engines are complaining. Notice that both Ron and the good Doctor both mention something along the lines of “if it is going to be unfrozen it should happen for everyone”. And then are complaining about the cost implications.
My guess is that the FIA have looked at the ECUs and have noted that Honda and Renault are behind on engines and are basically going to allow them to improve their engines. And not allow the front runners to do it.
October 15th, 2008 at 11:33 pmDom said:
Strange thing to say Jordan, seeing as that’s only happened once this season.
Also confused as to why we can expect Jenson to be out-qualified by Rubens when the pair have beaten each other in qualifying an equal amout of times.
October 15th, 2008 at 11:46 pmJordan Allen (How is Carla, the pole dancing Panda?) said:
Great, just great. Now who the hell in North America wants to think about seeing an F1 race if they cloest one is in San Paulo?
October 16th, 2008 at 12:10 amJordan Allen (How is Carla, the pole dancing Panda?) said:
That was before Button succesfully completed his only goal and that is to raid Honda’s coffers for next year was well.
Well, as Honda is the Better car than Force India, I would expect Button to be ahead of Force India too. But Button would rather daydream about how much money he is robbing Honda blind next year than be strapped in his Honda cockpit. Going slower than the Force India sure solves that problem for Button.
October 16th, 2008 at 12:23 amme said:
does he have a confirmed contract for next year then?
October 16th, 2008 at 12:53 amDom said:
With Bernie charging ever more for his races, the financial crisis of the outside world deepening and general lack of interest for the race, i guess this was kinda inevitable.
October 16th, 2008 at 5:02 amStuart C said:
According to the French contingent, the likeliest venue is the Rothschild-backed project. Bernie would be the promoter.
October 16th, 2008 at 3:59 pmKeith Collantine said:
I think it was quite a bit more than that - at least six I’d say: http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/2008japanesegpraceprogresshcart_zoom.gif
October 17th, 2008 at 12:01 pmlalpedal said:
it kinda is a Ferrari